The "marketing problem" -- what do we do?

In a long high-tech career I've had lots of involvement  with marketing types.  I've learned that nearly everyone with real-life experience and preparation...or even without it...has strong opinions about smart marketing.  Based on what I've seen in the business world, I believe smart and intensive marketing is the key place where UM has whipped our tails for the past 40+ years, and it then trickles into recruiting and in-season successes and failures. 

We can also see how ESPN, for example, has become a non-paid (or let's assume we can trust that it's non-paid for now) marketing channel for the SEC and Big 12 in football, and the ACC and Big East in hoops.  Their current ESPN "College Football" program has currently come close to promoting that there is no life beyond the SEC, and maybe the Big 12.  And, the Florida cheer-leading for months now is completely over the top.

Getting back to the state of Michigan, UM to me represents a far less appealing place and attitude than MSU.  But, it has, nonetheless, given MSU a consistent marketing whipping since the discipline began to get increasingly sophisticated in the late '60s.  I could speculate on the reasons out of my own experience and past life in Michigan.  But, I'm more curious why Spartan-nation participants here and in other forums seem to ignore the problem.  It's particularly baffling to me with tens of thousands of business degrees delivered by MSU to the state's residents, and with the humongous body of knowledge that represents. So, I'm curious what keeps the issue in passive mode.  

Will Mark Hollis, who is making improvements, get this thing turned around?  If you have a strong marketing background or just strong opinions about how this issue seems to continue, can you jump in here?  Let's get this puppy solved at least in the Great Lakes region where we can recruit well.  What do you think? 

Comments

[psyc]

Seems to me like marketing strength comes from a winning, proud football program. While Coach Izzo has had more than a decade of strength the football team was a wasteland before Coach D! We were a stepping stone for Saban, and I won't even start with the marketing nightmares of Bobby and John L. Winning is key but not the only factor. Bo instilled a legacy at UM that continued until last year. I think Coach D is on the same path!

We are definitely at a crossroads though! UM's marketing dominance has been strongly tied to the non-student, Big Three population that make up most of SE Michigan. The auto industry is aging and restructuring! Our states prominance within this country has taken a huge hit that I don't think can be recovered! The next 10 years will be huge in regards to national recognition for our state and big schools. This is our chance to take a big piece of UM's pie, we need to take advantage of it!

[vnflcards]

MSU had scattered and divided leadership for many years, which made it hard to put together any kind of cohesive direction for the university.

I think they're on the right track with president Simon letting Izzo, Hollis and D'antonio be the faces of the school.

They are putting forth the message that MSU is a place for family, hard work, and big aspirations. It's a message that is trickling down to every part of the athletic department and slowly improving their national image.

[starkreality]

Don Canham was the guru at scUM. He could be considered one of the best of all time. They are still benefitting from the philosophy that he implemented. I think Mark Hollis is the right man to implement a successful long term program. I agree with psyc in that winning is one of the key components to long term success.

[Sportster]

It's hard to overstate how much UM benefits from their geographic proximity to Detroit and the surrounding suburbs. All things being equal with the teams' win and losses, UM will get more and better news coverage because they are more easily viewed as the "home team" by the major population centers of Wayne, Oakland and Macomb counties. Unfortunately, while I think MSU can do some things to be more competitive from a marketing aspect, they will always be at a disadvantage.

[jerseyjohn]

all i know is this..i've travelled the world and i am always wearing spartan clothing..most of the time i run into to someone who is or knows a spartan..on the other end of the coin..i see u of scum crap everywhere and it is usually being worn by a gang member or a wannabe..i'm glad the country isn't swimming in spartan green because when i do see someone wearing it, i know they're one of us.

[fun size]

Academically, MSU is more visible than it has ever been, thanks to president Simon. Winning the FRIB bid was a huge boost to MSU's national prestige. Unfortunately, although academics are more important, they're not as sexy as sports.
MSU's last nationally network televised primetime football game was Notre Dame '06 so maybe we're still recovering there a little. As John L. said, we get national exposure from going to bowl games. Now that we're actually going to bowl games, that exposure will run its course.

[Wishing Mi. was NOT a Blue State]

Sporster that is just another good reason to let Detolit sucede to Canada

[Trophy]

I agree with the earlier poster regarding Don Canham. He was a genious. I remember being shocked/surprised that UM would send me a letter (along with every other elementary school student in the 60's/70's) touting UM. That's how they started getting all the support from non-alums.

[SpartylawinDC]

Great topic. All in all, MSU was playing second fiddle to UM for the last 40 years (and I think MSU accepted it, unfortunately). This is changing VERY QUICKLY, however. Winning is the key ingredient. People want to be associated with a winner. When a program wins on a regular basis, outsiders take notice and the fans begin to expect it. Additionally, the pride and tradition of winning becomes engrained in the fabric of the culture of the State/Region (as is starting to take place in Michigan for MSU hoops (this year's Final Four in Detroit basically locked up the entire state of Michigan's support for MSU hoops) and has already happened for UM football -- you can also see this with Indiana hoops in Indiana, Kentucky bball in Kentucky, UNC bball in NC and Bama football in AL).

I was in Atlanta for a wedding on the weekend of the Final Four and I walked around wearing all my MSU garb. My wife, a UNC alum, wore all of her UNC junk. Countless numbers of people (in Atlanta, mind you) came up to me to either wish me good luck, say "Go Spartans" or "Go MSU" (who were not fans or alums) or "Go Green" (who were alums or fans). Additionally, I counted about 15 people wearing MSU stuff in the mall I was walking around in. I think my wife got maybe 2 or 3 comments for her beloved Tarheels during the same time. She noticed it and I noticed it. When you create a winner, people want to be associated with it. MSU's basketball team is a winner, and I think outsiders like the program that Izzo is running, so naturally, MSU is a popular team to root for during March Madness. I have a feeling Dantonio is try to replicate the same thing for football. Hollis is a marketing genius. He knows exactly what he's doing. Don't sleep on Athletic Directors. A school's success and prestige can live and die by the quality of the AD at a school.

I was an out of stater that went to MSU, so I never really understood the rivalry b/w MSU and UM until I arrived on campus. But once I figured it out, I quickly sensed that there was some type of inferiority complex that MSU fans had over UM. You can't win a marketing battle if you feel inferior to your opponent. I think all the years of getting beat by Schembechler cause that complex. Again, this is changing, however. You can see it with hoops -- UM's fan base have basically conceded defeat in that department. Start winning in football, and the attitudes will change.

[John]

IF you want to market something appropritaely you need to consider what you're BRAND stands for and then have a consistency of purpose driving your message to the market. That consistency needs to permeate everything you do...not just be an promo piece.

Izzo has created a brand identity, "play anyone, anywhere, anytime - and win".

The football program has been a changing sea of 'brand'. Each coach having their individual message but with so little consistency that the consumer 'outside of MSU die hards' gets confused. We've gone through smashmouth (Perles), pro-style (Saban), Bobby-ball and slappy-ball spread philosophy. When you stand for nothing your brand has no equity; and unfortunately gets defined by others and your results. See ESPN for comments on spectacular wins (potential) and inconsistnecy (lack of consistent purpose).

The thing I'm most excited about is Coach D has a consistent message and it appears to permeate everything the football program stands for, including the way the team plays, the way they carry themselves off the field, the family environment around the program and the way they recruit. It's a ground up approach to building a MSU football brand AND I would argue is the way that is necessary for MSU to build something capable to stand the test of time. The football philosophy becomes even more powerful since it aligns with the basketball philsophy in my opinion.

As interesting to me from an in-state basis is that this brand appears to have some distinction from the brand that is being cast in AA across both mens basketball and football. Having a differentiated brand locally is important when the history of the two football options have had such different results on the field. In the past if you had the same brand (smash mouth) as UM; but were not winning. So you lose the hearts and minds of your target consumer.

At the university level, brand is something very different since it encompasses the campus, staff/student body, academics, athletics and what programs the 'u' applies its dicretionary resources against. Here UM has had the high ground as the 'elitist university' in the state; backed up by equivalent results on the field.

MSU is not going to topple that brand easily and probably shouldn't worry too much about trying to. In my mind MSU is about 'opportunity for greatness.' A great university FOR Michiganders. The way the sports programs are ideally conducted (above board, emphasizing hard work and a willingness or dare I say expectation to stand on the BIG stage) should be a refelction of the university. For the first time in my memory - I think the top revenue sports line up brand wise with what I personally see as the MSU brand.

That (with increasing doses of winning by the football program) should go a long way towards building an MSU brand and not having a rotating set of advertising campaigns wtih mixed messages. My two cents!

[West Coast Steve]

I just read Don Canham's bit in Wiki. It looks like his marketing smarts met with a confluence of good fortune, and a couple decades of marketing-effort stability and leadership that were key.

It sure looks like we've reached a similar opportunity:

1. Marketing smarts - Dantonio, Izzo, Mark Hollis and Prez Simon all "get it!"
2. Fortunate times (versus UM) -- this past year we were ahead of them in football and basketball...it's a start. They've been bipased by OSU in several sporsts. And, we passed IA, WI, and PU again in football.)
3. Leadership - we've made massive improvements at the very top with major-sport coaches and with Simon.
4. Stability - historically our very ugly Achilles' heel, and when leadership was occasionally stable, it was certainly not integrated or known to be very mutually supportive.

So, I'm left wondering about the vision and resources committed to MSU's five-year marketing plan. In the past there also was a professionalism issues. I remember a national ad campaign for football and hoops that ran for some years. It had an international studies focus with Ecuador and other countries referenced in the graphics. But, it was spelled "Equador"...for years! Humiliating slop for a marketing person playing right into you know whose stereotypes of MSU.

I'm curious: There must be a marketing master still in Michigan with a passion for MSU. I wonder what she/he would think about where we are in marketing today and, more importantly, how to get to the promised land over the next five years.

[Spartan_Legacy]

I think others have said it best: Marketing is all about winning.

Name 5 schools with national recognition that haven't been a powerhouse in either Football or Basketball. Once you get past the Ivy Leagues, which have a reputation based on academics, its pretty much all about success in sports. When a team is successful they pick up the bandwagon fans (i.e. Walmart Wolverines as they're often called here) who want to root for a winner. How many Dallas Cowboy fans are out there who have zero connection to Dallas or Texas? at least a million. Now, how many Detroit Lions fans are out there with zero connection to Detroit or Michigan? that's right, zero. Because they've been awful since forever, and no one wants to root for a loser.

The issue is that it takes money to make money, and it takes winning to keep winning (through great recruits). Izzo built up the b-ball program through landing a few key recruits and just generally being an awesome coach. Now a decade later with continued success the program is almost to the point where its a nationally recognized powerhouse. I think one more NCAA Championship will lock that in (next year please!).

Coach D is on the right track with football. We had a great season last year, with a lot of games just eeked out through good coaching, key plays, and luck. He built on that success by landing better than usual recruits. If that translates to some more winning seasons we'll be on our way...but I think it will take at least 5 years before State can really turn the corner in football

[Agesilaus]

Very interesting contributions, Spartans...

[theRichman]

Great posts folks! Sure Don Canham was a marketing genius but he was lucky too. The UM marketing empire came along at about the time Duffy retired and the MSU athletic dept. decided to go on a 35 year rollercoaster ride with the FB program . Fortunatly the BB program under Heathcote and Izzo have been very consistent and a national power . For a long time all we really could bank on was the hockey program under Coach Mason . Last season was bad but there is new young help on the way for Coach Comley. Kudos to Mark Hollis and the great job he is doing ! We have our own Canham in Mark . As Kermit the frog once said " It's good to be green".

[Michael Motta]

Obviously the football program and men's basketball program are important in terms of marketing. In order for hockey to become more than a mere accessory marketing-wise, TV coverage is still going to have to improve, and it already has a lot in the past decade or so. One thing college hockey has going for it is that apparently youth ice hockey participation has been spreading quite a bit geographically. College players aren't just from Canada, Michigan, Minnesota, and Massachusetts anymore - they're from places like Missouri and California. Another thing is that my impression is that the NHL is paying more attention to college hockey than it used to, for instance the NHL Network broadcasts live college hockey.

Hockey fanatics will kill me for saying this, but at this point, women's basketball is a better marketing tool than hockey. It gets much better, and more consistent national coverage. AND, it reaches a demographic that the big three men's sports don't reach quite as well - WOMEN. Yes I know women like men's sports, but there is a segment of females and families who get into women's basketball as much as any sport. I think MSU women's basketball was teetering and could have gone up or down as of 2008, but the Sweet Sixteen run to me tips things toward up.

[msu76]

U of M's PR dominance doesn't come from proximity to Detroit, but from tradition & winning. U of Illinois is 100 miles from Chicago, while Northwestern is right there. Likewise, U of Arizona is in Tucson & ASU is in Tempe, a suburb of Phoenix. In both instances, the school farther from the city dominates.

Getting the Spartans on WJR was a big boost, but it will take years of winning to supplant U of M and their familiar logo, colors & winged helmet. Just keep winning, though, and the public will eventually follow. There are lots of front runners in the public.

[Northy]

Great blog - probably my favorite yet.

I take a bit of exception to the fact that 'winning is the answer'. It's really the RESULT. It comes from great leadership a strong vision and a culture executing against the vision. Marketing should reflect the culture (the essence if you will of the program) AND highlight the glories to re-fortify the message.

The winning is the answer question puts organizations in the trap of finding the 'great headline hiring'. Sometimes they work, but they're seldom built for the long haul and have as many spectacular failures as successes.

Know what you want to be.
Set great leadership in place.
Build a consistent strengthening founding.
Stay to the program and market both the culture that drives the results AND the wins.

[Mark]

1. Don Canham was the father of college sports marketing.
2. U-M was one of the first schools to sign an exclusive deal with Nike.
3.ESPN, U-M has a lot of alumni working at ESPN in front of the camera and behind the scenes.
4. timing, unfortunately U-M was on top when college sports took off on tv, so they had higher ratings, the rich getting richer.
5. MSU is gaining ground by consistency, multiple logos, etc. however would like to see the Spartan head as the main logo over the generic block S or STATE.

[Bill Beach]

I agree with the poster that said this is the best post ever. Great comments and insite into marketing the MSU family. Students, alumni, family, fans all across the world, future spartans, etc., all want a university to be proud of. We have turned the corner with the leadership team currently in place. Let's keep it going.

I am also one in favor of the "Spartan Head" being the logo everyone remembers when thinking of MSU.

[MayoSpartan]

There are two things that ring true and have MSU and the Big Ten Conference at a disadvantage today:

1) As for MSU, marketing doesn't necessarily bring success like the cohesiveness of the university's students staff, faculty and alumni.

For example; MSU Alumni Assoc is a disgrace. We Spartans should have one of the largest and most active alumni associations in the country, and we are in fact one of the smallest associations in the big ten in proportion to the number of graduates.

Through a strong alumni association that networks in business and socially, it will filter down into deep pockets that creates and attracts talent that led to winning and presteige.

2) The Big Ten Conference has bulls-eye on its back by the networks that shape and form opinions. Our conference is one of the oldest and has the lions share of attention and power for years.

Now, the Big Ten Network has taken revenue away from ESPN/ ABC, CBS, NBC etc. Since the BTN dictates what games ESPN / ABC in football or CBS in basketball gets to cover, that comes with a price. Lower rating match ups equals lower revenue for the bad mouthing networks.

The BTN is the envy of all the other conferences, but it's costing the conference in other ways.

UM has an exceptionally strong alumni association, and until MSU's alumni association finds a way to increases membership, and encourage a more cohesive culture, MSU will find it difficult to establish continuity in academic and athletic excellence that prevent our on alumnus from labeling ourselves as the "same old Spartans"

I think Dantonio's dedication to attracting past players involvement in the program as game captains or helping our players like Morten Andersen, is the first step.

Now it's up to us to do it more in business, join the alumni assosc and contribute to activities and ideas. We need to make the effort to speak and to be heard.

GO GREEN!

[starkreality]

Although she has been mentioned a number of times in these posts I think it needs to be emphasized that the current upward trend for the MSU branding was initiated by Lou Anna K. Simon. She is the hardest working President in the Big 10 and truly bleeds green.

[MSULordyoda]

I agree with Mark's point 3. Timing had pretty much everything to do with it. Thanks to Bo and Woody, MSU football basically got what today would be considered the death penalty. They were not allowed on TV for several years and barred from bowl games. Consequently, UM got to be on TV a lot more during those years and we also lost out on the Rose Bowl in 1978 and any national exposure we could have had. It wasn't until Perles came along that things turned for the better, until he got greedy after the Rose Bowl in 1987, the sabotaging things again.

Couple that with all the political infighting that occurred between the trustees, presidents, AD's and coaches, and it was a PR disaster for MSU.

[student]

The key is having a great athletic department that creates revenue for MSU academic programs. MSU Dubai is doing its thing as well. Overall, MSU is developing a solid alumni association and reconnecting with them. The key is having a 15,000+ graduate student body to reduce undergrad admissions to 60% approx. and keep getting better. Overall, this marketing issue is very complex and involves aspects from out of state population, stereotypes, orientation day, graduation day, private funds, University leadership, and many more.

I like what it is being done here. This is something worthy of an article. I am an out of state student that loves MSU and I would love to hear more about this. When things are exposed people recognize it, understand it, and change their minds.

GO GREEN!!

[rbe]

Detroit..needs lots of work,that is why Coach Izzo wants to play there...MSU football was to play Western Michigan at Ford Field this year..That won't happen because of the economy. what about the rest of the State of Michigan? We live in Traverse City and its mostly UoM country same with Grand Rapids... Coach D. Would be well served to hold coaching clinics up here...
Since the MSU probation during Denny Stolz tenure, MSU athletics has be in disarray. Thanks to Politics,Bad Choices,"the good ole boy entrenchment" power in fighting of the MSU Board. Coach Izzo is the first bright spot, Honesty, forthrightness, WOW! Then the selection of an Athletic director who has energy and a progressiveness long lacking. Coach D. another good selection to solidify the troika. Now we have a permanence... Something the UOM hasn't had since The Fab Four.... remember "Every Dog has its Day" It's our turn...And being Green is good!

[West Coast Steve]

"student," excellent feedback...just the quality of young (my assumption) person MSU needs for a bright future. I've met many out-of-state people here in the Bay Area who in just two years of grad school fell in love with the place and energy at MSU, even if they went to Cal, WI or IA as undergrads. I'll noodle on this more; am curious about finding a way to turn this issue into maybe a bit of a call to action. On Thursday I'll see what I can post up to take this a little deeper; find a way for our visionaries to help lift the broader effort, both for MSU's well being and by extension the state's.